sacred buffalo breath
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LP torch

topic posted Wed, February 15, 2006 - 11:45 AM by  The Hogfather
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Any one here have any experience building an LP tiki torch?
posted by:
The Hogfather
Maryland
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  • Re: LP torch

    Wed, February 15, 2006 - 12:56 PM
    Actually they sell some metal ones that look almost period already. Once spring comes around start checking out Home Depot and I am sure you will find them.
  • Re: LP torch

    Thu, February 16, 2006 - 7:35 AM
    I've made a number of them,from simple poles to things as complex as the Hell sign torch. There are a few details to keep in mind.

    1) I use 3/4 copper, since 1 inch is expensive and 1/2 inch bends easily.
    2) You can solder all the connections but one. The connection closest to the flame needs to be silver soldered or brazed, which requires mapp gas or the addition of oxygen. Brazing is rough on the copper.
    3) I use a heavy brass cap that threads on the end for the tip. It will not burn through, is replaceable, and produces longer orifices.
    4) A plumbing union in the middle of a long torch is handy for transporting.
    5) I install a "T" in the pipe about a foot off the ground and put a nipple for the regulator hose here. Make sure you get the correct shape of nipple.
    6) Grill sized propane tanks seem to be the best balance of price, availability, and capacity. Make a sock or box for it if you don't like the look.
    7) the pattern and number of holes on the cap will shape the flame. Experiment to get the look you want. This is another reason to use removable caps.
    8) For the extremely safety concious, you can buy an anti-tip valve that will shut the torch off if it is tipped over or kicked hard.

    9) Orifice size is the most important consideration! Below a certain diameter, flame will not travel back through the constriction in the absence of available oxygen. So, if you drill big holes, when you shut it off, the flame can travel down the tube and back to the tank where it may well provide you with your 15 minutes of fame on the local news. It has been years, so I don't recall the exact specs. Maybe the holes needed to be 1/16th of an inch? Call your local industrial gas supplier to double check this.

    Hope this helps.
    • Re: LP torch

      Thu, February 16, 2006 - 8:31 AM
      I also noted that "Orifice size is the most important consideration!"

      Sorry to use techie terms, but I didn't want lack of clarity to produce a lack of safety, which would cause a lack of humor, that could be traced back to my advice.

      When I'm the one doing the project, lack of safety is never a consideration. (yes, now that you mention it, I Have used a chainsaw indoors,..)
    • Re: LP torch

      Thu, February 16, 2006 - 3:07 PM
      And get one of those rotating lawn-sprinklers to mount at the top, and light the three individual jets.
  • Warning

    Thu, February 16, 2006 - 2:54 PM
    Homemade devices like these are subject to being banned at Pennsic for safety reasons, just like towers.
    • Re: Warning

      Thu, February 16, 2006 - 3:36 PM
      True, but these torches are sold in the merchant area. Do a good clean job assembling them, and no one will know you saved a few bucks by making your own.

      I suppose they could be banned, but they are far safer than tiki torches. And I'd hate to see those banned.

      Towers weren't banned, but height / width ratios were established, along with maximum height restrictions. There are still a number of large structures at Pennsic.

      Pennsic does seem to have restrictive rules. At Gulf Wars, I once observed a Viking long boat built over a truck frame. They rowed with short oars while rolling around at 2 MPH. They would "land" near the gate of a camp and raid. It was great fun. Don't hold your breath expecting to see anything like this at Pennsic anytime soon.
      • Re: Warning

        Thu, February 16, 2006 - 3:54 PM
        If they haven't been an issue in the 6-7 years we've been using them, especially when the fire safety crew was invited into camp to inspect our equipment before our last big party, I'm thinking they're safe enough for Pennsic and Cooper staff's satisfaction. They are also lashed to a stake that is driven farther into the ground than probably 20 tiki torches I could find in a ten camp radius, and are all their height plus one foot away from anything else as required in the rules.
        • Re: Warning

          Fri, February 17, 2006 - 5:42 AM
          When ever somebody does something stupid, a rule is sure to follow (at Pennsic and in real life.) Problem is, you can't legislate intellegence, and we don't test for it as an entrance requirement at Pennsic (and then there is the intellegence lowering activities that further reduce the average IQ.)

          How can it be "common sense" when it seems such a rareity?
          • Re: Warning

            Fri, February 17, 2006 - 7:13 AM
            Forget intelligence, lets try testing for social skills as an entrance requirement for Pennsic. Ah, but that would decimate attendance even further than an intelligence requirement.

            Rules are usually formed when someone does something stupid. If only we could agree on a consistant universal definition of stupid... I see a number of things that I think are stupid (and sometimes beyond) but there are no rules against them. Then again, there are rules against things I would consider safe or acceptable.

            Now, if I were the Grand Poobah...
            • Re: Warning

              Fri, February 17, 2006 - 8:10 AM
              i can eat with a fork and spoon... and i can get along with my neighbors. :)

              love, honor, and respect... plus gental guidance and a helping hand... it makes for a good society.
            • Oh Poooh-baaah!

              Fri, February 17, 2006 - 1:38 PM
              (sounds like dip of sheep!)

              You wanna turban with that?
              • Re: Oh Poooh-baaah!

                Sun, February 19, 2006 - 9:01 AM
                Grand Poobah. From the Flintstones, get it? It was a joke, meant to imply that if I were in a position of power, I would change things, implying that I think I'm right.

                The comical mention of a fictional title was meant to self depriciatingly deflate the superiority of such authority.

                A bit of humor, wink, wink, nudge, nudge?
                • Re: Oh Poooh-baaah!

                  Sun, February 19, 2006 - 12:09 PM
                  Sure! Your joke was clearly a joke. Some here just don't get "it". Tag, you're "it"! Satisfied?

                  It's all fun and games until somebody has a problem with their pet project. Oh, the pain! The Pain!
          • Re: Warning

            Sat, February 18, 2006 - 8:08 AM
            If I must...

            Since some of you feel the tower was "something stupid", let me explain again for those too dense to comprehend the first dozen times we've explained.

            The seige tower was built with safety in mind. For starters, it's structure was OSHA standardized scaffolding. It had many platforms to stand on and ladders to get up to them. The outside was simply paneling ziptied to the scaffolding, with 1x6s to frame the corners. The entire tower stood about 23' high. Because of this height, we had our NASA engineers in camp devise the safety rigging, aka steel cable guide wires which attached via OSHA standard bolts at the top, and OSHA standard 2 1/2 foot wind anchors which were drivin into the ground at the bottom. These guide wires, one at each corner, solidified the entire tower to the earth. Our engineers did the math, and it would have taken some 750+ mph winds to make it even move at it's highest point.

            I can't recall the last time we had 750mph winds at Pennsic... how bout any of you know-it-all old timers? Shake that turban, maybe it'll come to you.

            As far as us taking it down, we were requested by Lady Sedalia to do so, because SHE felt it was unsafe. Even though we attempted to prove to her, with all our OSHA gear, our engineers, our schematics, or mathmatically equated drawings, and even physically climbing to the top of it and with all our might trying to shake it (without it budging); Lady Sedalia felt her mechanical knowledge outweighed our NASA engineers. I'm sorry... what does Sedalia do for a living? OH, yeah, she's an engineer... NOT.

            SO we obliged, and took it down.

            Upon later discussion with the land o crats, the Coopers, and all the other higher officials, the TRUE reason the tower had to come down was divulged to us. This is the reason;

            Though they (The Coopers, the Land o Crats, all other higher officials of that Pennsic, and the Pennsic following) DID FEEL IT WAS SAFE, the asked we take it down, as an example, so that not just ANY other Joe Shmo with a hammer and (in some cases) a Turban could decide they too were going to build such a high structure, most likely leading in disaster. You know, one of those "Here, hold my beer and watch this" incidents. They felt our building was safe, but didn't want to incite others to attempt the same. They felt having US take ours down and making the 16' rule was a future safety measure to avoid such "Know it all turban wearing muckity mukhs" from killing themselves, and possibly others.

            Now, having said this... again... HAVE I MADE THIS INCIDENT CLEAR?
            • Re: Warning

              Sat, February 18, 2006 - 11:07 PM
              Lady Sedalia is a good friend, and i like her.

              this being said, i can honestly tell you that a touch of royalty has made her a bit... mad.
              and she can be very very mean spirited as well...
      • Re: Warning

        Fri, February 17, 2006 - 1:56 PM
        Grim
        Pennsic hasnt always been as stuffy as it is now. The larger the event the more idiots it attracks and the more rules get written. And Pennsic is the biggest event we've got.
        I have to get to Gulf wars soon. Several people have told me its something like Pennsic used to be.
        Dont get me wrong - I love Pennsic at any size. I guess I just want an extra War some year.
        Maureen
        • Re: Warning

          Sun, February 19, 2006 - 9:20 AM
          Gulf Wars is very much the way I remember Pennsic being, say, more than a decade ago, if we consider size and organization. Gulf Wars is large enough to require similar organization, and yet, there is a more casual feel than Pennsic has.

          I can't really put my finger on it, but even when I compare Pennsic in it's smaller days it felt a little more - stuffy. It's not a night and day difference, but there seems to be less dogmatic adherance to the status quo away from Pennsic.

          More of a feeling that, it's OK for other people to have fun too, even if they (gasp) do it differently...
          • Re: Warning

            Sun, February 19, 2006 - 2:16 PM
            D'ner, I don't think she was being mean-spirited about it at the time. Part of the problem arose when the former campmaster was not very polite in his response to being asked to take it down. As Jackal said, it was not deemed unsafe. It was requested that we dismantle it so that others would not attempt such an elaborate project withOUT taking all the safety precautions that we did.
            • Re: Warning

              Sun, February 19, 2006 - 9:09 PM
              i see... :)
              • Re: Warning

                Wed, March 1, 2006 - 1:38 PM
                Too bad about the tower, - I liked it and thought it was gonna be one of the "war sights" that'd be around for a while. Like the Goat's Castle and the Oasis. And D'ner's horns... ;-)

                Sounds a little like the thinking of:
                "Since guns kill people, we should outlaw all the guns"
                Rather than:
                "If we just outlaw the idiots from having guns, which can only kill when misused, then we might all stand a better chance of seeing a peaceful and law-abiding Society".

                - Basically I guess it might have been both wiser AND more fun to just judge individual camps' erections (heh heh - yes, - I used that term on purpose...) on a case-by-case scenario, - rather than to just rule 'em all into a single category to discourage and make it easy....
                Sorta like the hemp debacle, - which could be fueling our vehicles to Pennsic this year rather than gasoline, and the making jeans/clothes out of which'd last 26 times as long as cotton does and save a lotta trees since it makes better paper were it friggin' legalized and used like it WAS for N. America's 1st 300 or so years... Oh, - but you can smoke it, - if you 1st breed it for about 15 years into strong-enough concentrations to make it hallucinagenic, - so let's ban it to keep the corporations happy and forget all it's cash-crop usablities...

                (I'm NOT trying to pick on anyone that responded earlier to this thread, BTW, - just injecting my as-usual too-opinionated-for-nice-company ways of lookin' at stuff... - I seem to have a bit too much time on my hands with this damn medical BS lately... - Sorry peeps..) ;-)

                Cheers!
                • Re: Warning

                  Thu, March 2, 2006 - 2:27 PM
                  I was one of the people who helped design and build the tower. I am sad that we couldn't make it a permanent part of the war experience.

                  The tower project was approached with one thing in mind, coolness. But just after that was safety. As bizarre as it sounds, we in Pentwyvern are very concerned with safety. It actually pervades any project we do. And it should be the must important aspect of ANY construction project from tower to torch. A good benchmark for safety is, would I let my wife/husband/kid use it? I've actually BEEN on fire, so I tend to be a little overzealous on the matter. (Forget about your camp for a moment, do you have a fire extinguisher in your house? Smoke alarms?)

                  Luckily there are a lot of pretty smart people in the SCA who are willing to share their knowledge and experience, and not just criticize.

                  There people must be exploited *choughGrimm* so that when you do build your (fill in danger object here) you have at least a 60% chance of walking away from it mostly unharmed when it all goes horribly wrong in some unexpected way. :)
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Warning

                    Thu, March 2, 2006 - 3:26 PM
                    Must be some bruised feelings about some old tower... to pop up here in a post about LP Torches!!
                    • Re: Warning

                      Thu, March 2, 2006 - 3:34 PM
                      well... i still see some high structures at pennsic... and the 'tower' probably could be made to 'under 16 foot restricted hight'... it was just so cool, that it is sort of sad that it isn't around.

                      but i'm sure there are lots of fun things to do and partys to see. the fun is still going on... : )
                      • Re: Warning

                        Thu, March 2, 2006 - 3:50 PM
                        I was about to mention that. The tower discussion began because someone brought up safety.

                        Meanwhile, Tom, how's the LP torch project coming along?
                        • Re: Warning

                          Tue, March 7, 2006 - 10:19 AM
                          Very well actualy!

                          I found a local art welder who makes our citys gas lights (in and around the parks). It was really easy and came to be about $8 in cost each, though I would not try to make one with out a pro helping.

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